source: https://youtu.be/uR5tFkncS0g?si=vILnev2pG3GcpjAP
title: Warren Buffett | Bill Gates | Lecture | Columbia University | January 27, 2017


transcription: 
wow uh thank you for coming uh thank you
president Binger and also to Columbia
for for hosting this um and we also very
much appreciate the people who here in
Alfred learner Hall and we want to
welcome everyone viewing on Facebook
live um these two guys sitting next to
me I'm known for a long time I probably
have done more interviews with the two
of you than anyone else I I I certainly
know that I always came away one having
fun and two learning something and my
guess is so will you this afternoon they
represent two different Generations but
they represent a kind of essential
friendship uh as bill has said it was
instantaneous uh when they first met
that they knew they would be great
friends um I should also say to you that
they have been here um before this was I
think in 2009 was it sounds right you
remember B yep
2009 and what was that event
called making America great wasn't
it keeping America great keeping America
we're entitled to a
royalty keeping America great in 2009 um
later we we I'll be here talking for
just a few minutes with them but this is
an opportunity for all of you to
participate there'll be people going
around with microphones I I ask you uh
in the interest of everybody here uh we
don't need speeches we need curiosity we
need people uh to really think about
what they're saying think about what you
think and in the most precise way you
can ask a question so that as many
people as possible will have chance to
be involved I we'll have considerable
amount of time you know to talk about
anything and and certainly everything
from your C curiosity about what they
know which is considerable uh but also
the world around you because they know a
lot about that too but I want to go back
to the idea of this friendship Warren uh
what is it that you two share what makes
this friendship so satisfying for both
of you well I think we both certainly
share a curiosity about the world and we
come from two different but related
worlds uh so we had I think we probably
spent about 10 hours of this one-hour
visit that bill was scheduled on July
5th 1991 his mother had to talk him into
it and uh uh we weren't halfway I mean
we' got no place in terms of our
eventual agenda just in in that time in
fact the governor of Washington came by
and Bill's dad had to come into the
bedroom and pull us out we didn't want
he was a little embarrassed we were't
talking it's well we have fun to start
with I mean that every relation should
should have a lot of fun in it and and
we we we find the world in just such an
interesting place so we like to compare
notes on it when we have compare notes
we have a lot of fun doing it part of
the time is I remember the conversation
by the way there's a remarkable
documentary about Warren which is on HBO
uh I think it premieres on January 30th
on Monday uh you should take time to
take a look at it uh Bill's involved in
that and and you will see in a sense
it's called think becoming War Buffett
yeah that's what it's called
becom took me 86 years but I
got you're doing well on it though well
so far yeah Best Is Yet To Come one of
the things that happened tonight bill
was that I guess your dad uh at the
dinner said you know what is it you
what's been the most important quality
for you and you found out that you and
Warren had the same
word yeah I think curiosity uh which
Warren mentioned
is a an amazing thing where you try and
predict what's going to happen and then
uh when it doesn't you sort of think
well uh you know that uh drug didn't get
invented that stock didn't go up that uh
approach wasn't popular what's what is
it about my model of the world that's
wrong you know who could I talk to what
could I read and and the things that
have happened since
1991 uh mostly good things
uh have been amazing and just you know
so much fun to talk about uh you know so
you know it we read the news and we
think God what did Warren think about
that you both are readers you both you
read all the time all day Warren Bill
are you're read a reader you also do a
lot of sort of courses online as well
what does that have done what has that
done for your life the sense of
constantly
learning go ahead bill it's an
incredible time to be a learner I
remember when I was young you I had the
world book which is one of Warren's
products uh and it was very good but you
I always felt like God I I want to get
into this more depth I want understand
it better today the videos that are
online and the courses that you can buy
with the very best
professors it's phenomenal you know take
a subject like weather or climate change
you or what's going on in economics
what's known what's not not known now
with the foundation a lot of what I need
to learn is about biology making
vaccines and uh what's going on with
these these various diseases this is a a
phenomenal time to be a curious uh
person the information that's out there
you know I have a my my biggest problem
is that I stay up too late because I'm
reading and then I'm a little bit tired
the next day uh the other thing that
that you share other than reading is
optimism uh you believe in America
absolutely abely yeah you have said to
me more than once uh I would give up a
year of my life just to know what the
next 50 is going to be like yeah even
the next four now I
mean why'd you pick four I don't know
number that came to
me the um uh it is it is just
fascinating what's happened just in my
lifetime you know in the 86 years I
should mention one thing about reading
uh it was at the Library here at
Columbia that I wish I spent probably
more time than any other uh student I I
I lived there practically but you I
pulled the book out there happened to be
huzu an American it told me something
about my professor Benjamin Graham and
then I looked up and I went to the
librarian and I said I want to look
learn more about this because I learned
this over here that changed my whole
life you know we own Geo now uh because
of uh that librarian directing me to
some other book and then follow going
through on that it's the chance I I I
read about one5 the pace the bill does
but I still spend five or six hours a
day reading I mean it just you can learn
so much I particularly love biography
just uh you know to be able to live the
lives of these people that have been so
see them so extraordinary the lessons
and the you know the discouragements
they face just everything about it so I
just you can't get enough of reading it
U what surprises you most about Bill
uh that's an interesting question I
guess what really surprised me initially
we just found so many things to connect
on but uh uh he did try to sell me a
computer
uh that that's probably the only sale he
didn't make although computer changed my
life for the better in a big way
subsequently but uh well he he he just
had the same curiosity and the other
word you have used is focus well the
focus is no question about I mean
both of us got to where we are in a big
big way because of focus Bill what
surprises you about
Warren I was so amazed that he comes to
investing with this broad model of the
world so one of the first questions he
asked me was hey Microsoft's a small
company IBM's this huge company why can
you do better why can't they uh beat you
at the software game that you're playing
and I I always you know you know every
day I was thinking about okay what
advantage do we have what do we do but
nobody ever asked me that question and
we talked about the economics of
software which is a you know very uh
different and special thing and he could
relate it to things that he'd seen and
you know I didn't understand banking why
some get ahead and some don't and so he
was able to put that in very uh clear
terms and so I I found somebody whose
model was rich enough that it it helped
me understand things that I really
wanted want to know and we could laugh
about things that were surprised to us
I'd say his humility and his sense of
humor really stood out in this
incredible way I mean he enjoys what he
does and he shares that with other
people and even you know when I ask
questions that are pretty naive that
he's probably been asked 50 times he's
very nice about well it took me a long
time to figure this out bill but here's
how it
works I I tried bill out with some
non-transit of Dice and i' read about
him in scientific America or some place
and there were only two people in the
world in the history of these dice that
actually figured it out while I was
trying to take their money from them and
one was the leading symbolic logician in
the world and the other was a drunk who
didn't really know any better asked the
wrong question but Bill said wait a
second you choose first and the game was
over uh you you taught him not you
didn't teach him but you brought him
into a great appreciation of bridge yeah
he' play bridge but the family very big
on games his family was very very big on
games and and uh and so we we we we
played Bridge together and we played in
China going down Great Rivers when we
were supposed to be looking at the scene
we but we had a good time Point brid all
right we got a lot of questions we want
to talk from the audience somebody we
want to start up in the up in the
balcony so we so you know we haven't
forgotten you uh it's hard to see uh but
is there a number there that has a
question uh okay start it wherever it is
yes number six
uh thank both of you guys for being here
today uh my question is in regards to
Public Health and
vaccinations um given our current pre uh
president publicly stated stance against
the use of vaccinations both in this
country and abroad how would you
recommend that we as students and Future
Leaders in Health Sciences best allocate
our resources to most effectively resist
his alternative fact political
philosophy in regards to domestic and
Global Public Health thank you well bill
it's a good place to start
uh
yeah well the facts about vaccines are
very clear and very strong which is both
uh that they're safe and that the
vaccine schedule has been designed uh to
reduce disease and you know the more
parents that adhere to it the more not
only their children be protected but you
have some kids who are immune deficient
and so unless the kids around them are
protected then it puts those kids at
risk and there are diseases like measles
or pertusus that all it takes is a small
cluster and then mostly those diseases
would be coming in from overseas but you
can get infection and in in some
European countries you've had deaths
because uh the kids weren't vaccinated I
don't think the US government uh is
going to come out with any negative
statements there may be a commission and
fortunately if you look at the facts the
facts are quite
unequivocal uh we certainly are speaking
out in favor of vaccines so I I uh you
know I'm a little surprised that we have
to stick up for them but it's true in
every country uh that you get these
rumors and particularly in today's media
those rumors can get out and ahead of
the facts because the rumors are sort of
more salacious or uh you know contrary
to what you've been told type things uh
here I'm sure we'll have a chance if
necessary to to go through the facts
again and and get a clear positive
message from the government and the risk
is if vaccines somehow people are scared
of having vaccines the risk is well
they're uh we're engaged right now in
polio
radication and the only way that
succeeds is to get 95% of the kids to
have these vaccines and there we found
we ran into a form of anti-vaccine
sentiment that's even worse uh than us
rumors and that is that two ter groups
one in Nigeria Boku Haram and another
one in Pakistan Afghanistan the
Taliban said that vaccination was a US
plot and you know would sterilize women
and it was a a very bad thing and they
took the women who are going out to the
children's houses and giving these oral
drops oral polio vaccine and actually
killed a number of them and so those
negative rumors the only reason we still
have polio today that we're not done is
because of that part of Nigeria that bam
has caused unrest in the uh border areas
uh including bistan in Pakistan where
there have been these antivaccine
sentiments so you know our risk is is is
simply those negative things so it's not
just in rich countries that we run into
this it
absolutely is causes deaths if parents
don't know bring your kids in and and
get them fully vaccinated and your drive
to eradicate polio is to show that you
can do it well it'll be it started in
1988 when it already had been eradicated
in the Americas so these were the fir
the US in the 60s the rest of the
Americas in the 70s showed that it could
be done and so in 1988 uh well before
our foundation was involved uh rotary
and a number of other organizations said
let's get rid of this and it's been
harder than was expected just because of
these these sentiments you know here in
2016 a 17 last year less than 50 cases
so we are very very close in fact
there's so few cases now the way that we
track where the virus is is we go and
look at sewage samples and we see
because a lot of kids uh get infected
and pass along without getting paralyzed
and so it's only through these sewage
samples we know that there's still about
four places in Pakistan and Afghanistan
and and one place in Nigeria that we we
haven't gotten there yet all right let's
see next question uh I got to see a card
number
one thank you both so much for being
here my question again sorry is uh a
little bit on the political Spectrum I
was wondering what you're both most
hopeful about in this new political
environment we have and also what you're
both most worried about you want to take
hope or worried
Martin well I'm I'm I'm confident that
America will move ahead it's been know
from the time I was born until now the
real GDP per capital of this country has
gone up 6 for one I mean nobody ever
dreamt that would be possible and and
when you look at what's happened in this
country over 240 years you know it's
it's it's an absolute Miracle when I
went to Columbia business school in
September
1950 one woman in the class I mean this
country moves forward and uh you can't
stop it so I I'm enormously op I I say
the luckiest person born in the history
of the world is the baby being born
today in this country and we will go and
you know everybody half the country
always is going to be a somewhat unhappy
close to half about the last election
but uh I grew up in a
household uh in the late 1930s my dad
was very Republican we my sisters and I
didn't get deserted unless we said
something bad about Roosevelt I mean it
was just it was it was
required and I heard all these
apocalyptic views about after his third
term there'll be no more elections I've
been hearing that all my life and you
know year after year after year with
occasional hiccups and and an occasional
seizure like we had in 2008 and N but
this country it's all profit folks I
mean you know when I came in just think
of what it would have been like in 1776
nothing here and now we've and the
velocity of change just keep moving I
mean guys like Bill you know they don't
quit you know I mean he he moves on to
something like polio he mentions 50
cases in the world there were more than
50 in the ward where I went when I was a
teenager to see a friend of my sisters
and they were all in these rocking
machines and everything they were
destined to a terrible terrible life and
it was just one word in Omaha and and
now that's you know that's the yearly
total thanks initially to as well as
currently to the rotary and some but
people kept working out this world moves
forward and it's been doing I bought my
first DOC when I was 11 in April of 1942
the doll was 100 if you haven't looked
it's 20,000 something good must have
happened in between and it's going to
keep happening folks Bill I know you
share the optimism what about
concerns well the optimism uh is partly
that I think American innovation is
strong uh you know support for research
is by and large
bipartisan and so whether it's Health
breakthroughs or even energy
breakthroughs I think you know every
year that goes by we're going to have
more of those things now this
Administration is new enough we don't
know how their budget priorities will
come out you know there are things like
foreign aid uh which is a small part of
the budget about 30 billion a year but
that means the US is the biggest that
every time there's new leadership we
have to go in and
articulate uh the benefits it's well
spent it's not the image that people
have in the past and so right now I
think there's a lot of
intensity uh to make sure we get that
message out and get both in terms of the
executive branch and the Congress to
maintain amazing things like the
president's malaria initiative or pepar
which is an HIV thing these things
started under President Bush and so our
foundations had a great working
relationship with Democratic and
Republican administrations most people
wouldn't realize that US foreign aid as
a percentage of the economy which is
generally how it's measured reached its
L point in
1999 uh under the Clinton Administration
now I'm not saying it was the
administration it was a mix of the
administration of the Congress uh then
uh during those Bush years it went up uh
fairly substantially now the economy
helped with that but these initiatives
were really amazing and you know I'm
hopeful that maintaining or even growing
uh these initiatives will be a priority
when there's a lot of talk about tax
cuts and different spending activities
and so it is a bit up in the air uh
during these months ahead and you've
often made the point that no matter how
big the private contributions are
sometimes in terms of tear sheer scale
you need a government yeah somebody
asked me today you know if pepar which
is this AIDS program uh was cancelled
wouldn't private philanthropy make up
for it well pepar is over five billion
year that is this one aid program which
is a phenomenal thing that's saved uh
over 10 million lives that's larger than
our foundation which is uh the the
largest in the world so there's no
possibility the government sector us UK
other European donors uh that's $130
billion year in total that's uplifting
these poor countries in health and
education and if we lose the consensus
around that if if people draw inward too
much the we will hurt progress and there
will be millions of lives lost because
of it and one thing that might be
mentioned Charlie is
that the difference between now and 60
or 70 years ago in the ability of really
bright people really Innovative really
energetic people to get Finance to do
things is is just dramatically better
than than it was at that time so now if
you've got good ideas and there's good
ideas Right In This Crowd and you've got
energy it's far easier to get financed
to move forward those ideas than you
could 50 or 60 years ago is that because
of the internet or crowd crowd sourcing
of what is there just lots more Capital
around and people more optimistic
about people are very optimistic about
business and but better ways to connect
the capital and those absolutely IDE
it's dramatic it's dramtic and the
willingness to take risk uh you know the
first Venture Capital stuff is in the
1960s and it's tiny uh Microsoft when we
were uh taking outside investment we
took a uh at a valuation of $20 million
we took a million for 5% of the company
I'll do it retroactively folks and uh
you had your chance you had your chance
we we we never spent the money that is
our business was profitable enough we
really didn't need to do that but we
wanted people on our board to give us
advice and uh there's an episode of
Silicon Valley where all these Venture
capitalists are are courting this guy
and that really reminded me of what it
was like by that time which was 19 uh 84
there were dozens of venture capitalists
and that's something that other
countries have tried to duplicate they
have uh in small part but not nearly as
well this this willingness to take risk
the idea that if you have the failure
it's not a mark of shame that hey what's
your next startup going to be you heard
of secret folks he gets his ideas from
Silicon Valley be
sure all right uh car cards let's see
where the cards
are okay number three take the card
right
there so you started this talk um about
how You' able to make a model and it
won't accurately predict what happens
and on the other side of the coin I was
wondering what happens when you create
such well-developed predicted technology
and what are the ramifications and
implications of that
outcome well I don't think our
predictive technology
uh you know is going to be like an
oracle Warren's nickname is the Oracle
of Omaha uh but you know the the
percentage of times you can prct things
like macroeconomics because they
involve uh emotional sentiment you know
we're a long ways away from that the
biggest modeling thing I'm involved in
is a group that models diseases so we
look at HIV or tuberculosis and
understand okay what do we have to do in
terms of diagnosis and drugs to get
these things down once we finish polio
we'll go on and our next big challenge
which will take decades but I expect it
will be done in my lifetime is malaria
eradication so these models aren't
nearly at the point where they can take
human sentiment into consideration you
know the field of
Economics h a very basic question about
what we should have done differently
before the financial crisis uh there
really is no consensus whether it's with
the public or inside the profession of
economists they they agree that some of
the emergency treatment we did uh was
necessary and important and you know I
wish that was was better understood but
the in terms of the root causes it's
actually a little disconcerting how
little our models are understanding uh
explain how that imbalance got so
extreme all right well number two
hi my name is I'm in the engineering
school here at Columbia and I wanted to
ask um you were talking about that you
love reading I wanted to ask if you have
a particular book that it changed your
life like the way you think about things
and I also wanted to ask um what is the
thing that you admire the most about
each other like you build about Warren
and the other way around thank you they
sort of touched on the on the second
question but go ahead and may want to
add to it books though first change your
life well a book did change my life and
it was by a fellow who taught here at
Columbia Benjamin Graham and I read the
book when I was 19 called the
intelligent investor and i' I'd been
interested in investment since I was
maybe seven or eight but I'd never and
I'd read every book in the public almost
Public Library by the that was 11 why do
you think you were interested in
investing when you were seven or
eight because I was too dumb to get
interested at four
my dad my dad had an very small
investment firm and I would just I read
all the books that he had there you know
waiting to go to lunch or whatever it
might be and then I went over the public
library and read them all and and it it
it just was a fascinating subject to me
and and but I didn't have any I I knew
what everybody thought all of that at an
early age but what Graham wrote made
sense I just happen to pick that book up
at a bookstore in Lincoln Nebraska and
but but to investing per se uh did is
there something about your core
competence that made investing the
perfect place for you to be yeah it
certainly wasn't be a pro football
player I
mean I I mean I looked it was the
question of zeroing out all the other
incompetencies you know and I was left
with one thing you know the uh uh no I
allocation of it it it I was actually
wired in a way that was this would be
something I would be good at so what
wired in what way I I can't tell you
precisely but I I I've got the right
temperament for it which is much more
important than IQ if you got more than
120 points of IQ sell sell the rest to
somebody else you don't needed
Investments but but you do need the
right temperament you do you do have to
be able to think for yourself and
getting back to you know the uh earlier
question the first question I ask myself
when I look at a business is you know is
it important and easy what I can
determine about this business and a lot
of them don't make it now bill is
looking for a hard question that that
that plague society and where intellect
and money may make a difference they may
not for a while and but he he's taking
on the tough things I take my job is to
find easy things I'm looking for one
foot bars to step over you know rather
than eight foot bars to jump over you
know and but that's not irrational if
you're if you're looking at the
investment universe but reading is key
on the biography uh on the on the book
thing I will tell you a wonderful book
to read uh I can tell you a number of
them in investor obviously if you're in
the investment field but Catherine
Graham's autobiography uh is a marvelous
book and it's absolutely honest told by
a an incredible woman who had an
incredible life and then wrote honestly
about but and and someone who you knew
very well and invested with and she was
a bit reluctant and had to be assured
you know that she was afraid of me
actually
yes uh but what makes that book so much
it's just
it is such a broad range of Human
Experience honestly told I mean you
couldn't have nobody in h would could
write
up you know a a scenario that she lived
through and and just to see that world
develop how she reacted to it and
everything you can learn so much my
partner Charlie merer just loves Ben
Franklin you know I mean he I mean you
know you can learn from other people and
and their mistakes and and I find
biography is my favorite part of the
reason you love biographies Pardon Me
part of the reason you love biographies
okay where is a
card uh right here just come here I'm
I'm having a hard time seeing the card
so that right here see where the hands
are
raised hi my name is CH I'm a senior
here at the college I'm also a Gates
Millum scholar with my family over here
um so I'd like i' like to ask so what
both of you do involves a lot of risk
and sometimes you have to face the feel
of failure with that risk so I'm asking
how did you overcome that fear and what
steps did you take to do
that well I think I was very lucky that
uh when I was in high school the
computer was brought in there and I
developed a Fascination for it and
became kind of fanatical about it so
that
you know I didn't view it as risky I
viewed it as this kind of fun hobby even
when I went to college which I didn't
finish but I I spent time uh up in
Cambridge Massachusetts uh the I wasn't
sure that would be my life's work now as
the chip came along and made it
mainstream it became very obvious that
something dramatic uh was was going to
happen and so my my passion my hobby and
the area I could start this company
right at the beginning of the the
revolution that coincided in a nice way
and I never felt it was risky I I you
know if Microsoft had failed I didn't
have kids or anything I could go back to
school and uh you know finish my degree
and you know go get a job somewhere I
was very risk averse in in running the
company I always made sure we had enough
money in the bank to pay everybody for
at least a year if nobody paid us at all
because this idea I was hiring people
who had kids and families and they were
moving to work there and here I was you
know 19 20 years old and sort of telling
these people I'd be paying their
salaries so I I was actually very
conservative on a financial point of
view and one of the few arguments I had
with Steve Balmer who came in and played
a phenomenal role in the success of the
company was sh how many people could he
hire uh because I was trying to be so
conservative but I let him go full speed
and uh you know it turns out our
financial success meant that we never uh
had a conflict about that but you know I
think it's great to be risk taking uh
particularly when you're young trying
out different things fields that you
know aren't very popular that you might
enjoy but I never got into a position
where I I was taking U actually in any
meaningful sense I was taking a big risk
I mean the risk for you would not to
have acted because you felt the train
was leaving the station yeah and it was
so clear uh that you know this was going
to happen and this was so much fun I
mean you know I was a fanatic I didn't
believe in weekends I didn't believe in
vacation uh my mom had to negotiate with
her I'd come once a week for dinner uh
no matter who the guest was that's right
that's right yeah but but Warren you
have often said you still tap dance to
work because you can paint with your own
colors yeah I I I
get I'm as excited about tomorrow in
terms of what is going to happen as I
was when I started I was having a lot of
fun when I started but I'm having just
as much fun uh now and and I was when I
was here in Columbia I I had this
terrible fear it was impossible for me
to speak in public I mean I wasn't able
to do it I actually read an ad the New
York Times I went down to Midtown signed
up for a course gave the guy a check and
then sto payment on the check I mean it
just petrified but finally I and and
actually after you get through hearing
me today maybe you'll wish I'd stayed
afraid of public speaking but that's
another question that when I got out the
Alo I finally decided just had to do it
so I gave a guy a $100 in cash and once
I parted with $100 in cash I you know I
jump off the Grand Canyon to get my
money's worth so it but it change it
changed my life but I would say this
don't fear failure almost everything
that's turned out I got turned down by
Harvard the best thing ever happened uh
among other some good things in that
happened it didn't seem good at the time
don't worry about and don't don't let it
eat at you or look back just keep going
because you're going to have some things
and forget them go go forward all right
I want to go to the back of the room
right back
there wherever number three
is hi my name is Matthew man I'm a first
year at Columbia business school both of
you had a moment where you went out on
your own and I guess my question would
be if you were to do it all over again
you're in our shoes what industry would
that be in where would you start your
own business
today I do the same thing yeah I
mean for one thing I'd be a failure at
anything else probably I'm not no I mean
I have had I had fun when I was in my
20s my 30s now I'm 86 I'm having fun and
so I I advise students as much as
possible look for the job that you would
take if you didn't need a job I mean you
don't sleep walk through life and don't
don't say it's all going to be great you
know I'll do this and I'll do that and
you know I'm just marking time to get to
be older that I've told people that's
like saving up sex for your old age I
mean it just is not it it is not a good
idea yeah
yeah what are you urging them to do I'll
explain
it just what I'm talking
about now it it you just yeah you really
want to be doing what you love doing and
you can't necessarily find it on your
first job right but don't give up before
you find it Bill you've had the unique
experience a because of your curiosity B
because of your involvement in in global
Health to see the impact of a lot of
other areas uh whether it's biom
medicine or whether it's you know a
whole range of other things other than
computer science if you
going to drop out of Harvard today
uh which field would you be most likely
attracted
to well I love the hard sciences and
there's some phenomenal things that
people will get a chance to be part of
uh I'd still probably pick computer
science because the work in artificial
intelligence today is at a really
profound level uh you know our ability
not just to play games but that is a
profound Milestone the the alphao work
that the Deep Mind people at Google were
able to achieve and that kind of
Technologies in all the leading
companies and a lot of universities with
AI creation of Agents the ability to
read and understand material it is going
to be phenomenal so anything connected
with that I think would be an exciting
lifetime career I also think in energy
uh we have the imperative to have energy
that's reliable cheap and clean
and no system available today can
provide that whether it's for rich
countries or for for poor countries and
so the Innovations there will be
profound and there's many paths that uh
could provide that solution finally I
think biology it's the most thrilling
time you know we are going to figure out
uh obesity cancer uh even things that
are very hard like depression because uh
the you know the mind is is is even more
complicated than other uh parts of the
body I see this through the lens of the
disease of the poor the infectious
disease where new vaccines new drugs we
are moving faster than ever and some of
these are platform Technologies like DNA
vaccines that are going to give us just
that one thing will give us lots and
lots of solutions and so working in that
space uh is is phenomenal now I say this
you know to my children uh and you know
they they may not want to do hard
Sciences the the one who's picked wants
to counsel patients and and be a doctor
and even more than the science piece
that relationship with patience is what
grabs her so everybody has their own
taste but in terms of big impact those
three hired science problems would be at
the top for me all right next right here
right next to number
one uh hello uh thank you guys for being
here also thank you to Mr Gates I am
also a gate scholar and without your
foundation I wouldn't be here uh many
industrial based communities have been
severely affected with higher levels of
unemployment due to the increasing
utilization of automation which ends up
displacing workers what do you believe
what do you believe is a possible
solution to unemployment arising from
automation it's a good question uh
because there's a lot of talk about
globalization and all of that uh and a
lot of other people step forward and and
and talk about how technology and the
impact technolog is having on jobs and
and the demand for new kinds of skills
yeah we were here in 1800 and conducting
this uh and somebody would point out
that uh eventually tractors would come
along and and better fertilizer and
everything and that 80% of the people
are now employed on the farm and in a
couple hundred years it's going to be 2
or 3% and what are we going to do with
all these people well the answer is we
release them we KES wrote something
about it in something called essays on
persuasion he wrote in 1930 about what a
more prosperous society would become
like and he actually
postulated that uh in 100 Years and
we're now 87 years old from that that
there would be four to eight times as
much output per capita and you know he's
remarkable uh but he he didn't quite get
out might get distributed but the idea
of more output per capita which is what
the progress is made on productivity
that that should be harmful to side is
is crazy I mean the distribution may be
a problem but if one person could push a
button and turn out everything we turn
out now is that good for the world or
bad for the world you know you'd have to
figure out how to distribute it but but
you'd free up all kinds of possibilities
for everything else so you every
everything should be devoted initially
to getting greater productivity but
people who fall by the wayside through
no fault of their own as the goose lays
more golden eggs should still get a
chance to participate in that prosperity
and that's where government comes in
right Bill didn't they add to that
yeah the a problem of excess is a
different problem than a problem of
shortage you know if all the tractors
and computers stopped working then we
would have problems of of shortage there
uh and you know we just wouldn't have
enough people to to make the output a
problem of
excess really forc us to look at the
individuals affected and take those
extra resources and make sure they're
directed to them in terms of
re-education ation and incomes policies
and the need for labor in terms of
smaller class size helping handicap kids
reaching out to the elderly the demand
for labor is not at zero uh if you ever
get to that point fine you can shorten
the the work week and uh you'll you'll
be just just fine with that and so the
this idea of taking an individual who
during their generation is affected I
think there's a lot to be learned about
that a lot of thinking uh we have to do
but the macro picture that it
enables uh is is is an opportunity
number
two also I'm urging people at the back
so you have a chance we want to go back
up to the balcony as well uh so I see
number six we'll come to six after two
yes hi my name is Sam I go to Columbia
College and my question is what steps do
you think need to be taken in order to
improve public education particularly in
uh economically depressed areas of the
United
States I think this is a a super
important issue because the uh Dropout
rates although they've gone down a
little bit uh they're still very high
and and very based on income and even
kids who graduate a lot of them don't
enter college or they do enter college
and they end up in these remedial cour
es uh for their reading or math
capabilities and those people have an
extremely high dropout rate from higher
education and you know they can incur
debt they have a negative experience uh
so we have a long ways to go in
education there are some very strong
points of light like here in New York
City some of the charter schools are
with even less resources than uh schools
at large doing a phenomenal job of
educating kids there are a lot of
countries particularly in Asia who
spending way less of their GDP on
education are doing a great job
educating their kids and it's not just
the top 20% their bottom
20% is pretty phenomenal in the case of
china South Korea and Singapore and so
looking at what we've learned in charter
schools in terms of building the culture
giving teachers feedback uh what is good
teaching look like do we give teachers a
chance to learn from each other about
that interactive element that makes the
subject seem relevant and important
there are uh great teachers but
spreading those practices is has been
very very tough and so I'd say it's a a
top priority and we've T our foundation
has that for our work in the United
States education is is the top priority
whereas outside the US uh we we take on
health it's a tough problem because the
institution of Education are fairly
resistant to change and people are are
not yet convinced by various approaches
very easily uh but we need to keep at it
we're going to you know stay and even
actually put even more money into trying
to help help create models okay U up
number
six hi first I want to thank bill I
witnessed the role of your foundation in
eliminating polio in India and I'm
really thankful for that uh my my
question is uh more on how to set the
basic level of debate in any any public
sense like there are many trade-offs how
to explain climate change policy for
people who are losing losing jobs in in
the coal sector how do you balance uh
the current current short-term economic
goals with a long-term peaceful
transition to the renewable sources of
energy no it's a good question and the
certain topics are so complicated like
climate change
that to really get a broad understanding
is a bit difficult and particularly when
people take any of that complexity and
trying and create uncertainty about it
uh and you know for example India's kind
of paradigmatic in that they want to
Electrify for all sorts of good reasons
having to do with health and reading at
night and uh quality of life and the
question of should they delay
electrification
uh for climate issues is is going to be
very difficult the ideal is to innovate
in such a way that they can go full
speed ah had on electrification without
emitting the CO2 that a the natural path
of them today which is coal is the way
to to go and so we have a lot of cost
reduction to do uh because rich
countries may be able to buy premium
electricity when you get to Middle
income or lower that's just just not
going to happen
and you know democracy has us allocate
these resources in terms of investing in
the future and things like research uh
and investing in in the present and when
you have a problem like the financial
crisis then you do get a little bit of
more of short-term thinking and I'm
hopeful I think it's better for the
world and for the country if we can get
back into uh a little bit more of a a
focus on the long term we have question
from Facebook um Warren a central tenant
of your investing is to invest for the
long term and this comes from Brian
White who says how might Bill and Warren
convince investors to think Beyond
short-term returns to encourage world
changing
Innovation well I've spent my life
trying to convince people of investing
for the long term listen if I know how
to double my money tomorrow I'd probably
invest for the short term
too I I uh it's much it's much easier to
invest for the long term if you're just
talking pure investment because you know
what's going to and I my view the very
high probability what's going to happen
10 and 20 years from now in a major way
and I don't have the faintest idea
what's going to happen tomorrow or or
next week uh but you when you get if
you're talking about societal uh it it's
very tough because politicians face
elections either every two years or 6
years and the way
the way uh particularly congressional
districts have been organized primaries
have become more and more important and
so it's very hard to have uh politicians
think of something that's wonderful for
the country for 20 years but will cost
them the election two years from now and
that that's a basic problem in a
democracy and it gets to be more of a
problem as as we
get arrange we've arranged congressional
districts so the primary dominates
because a very limited number of people
turn out and their motive tend to be on
the extremes of both parties so it uh
it's not easy whether you're going to
make an investment in a company or
whether you're going to buy the company
what are the factors that you have to be
that you're looking for what test I'm
looking for durable competitive
Advantage I'm looking for something that
has a moe around it for a considerable
period of time and I'm looking for an an
honest and able management to run it
because I don't know how to run it
myself and I'm looking for a a purchase
price that's not excessive but it's
better to pay a little too much for
something that's a very good business uh
than it is to buy some bargain uh but
really a company without much of a
future and I don't
know I don't have a ability to predict
with a high high probability of success
the future of most companies so I'm
looking for the exception but the nice
thing is if there's thousands of
companies out there I really only have
to be right on a couple I mean it's it's
exactly the opposite of of baseball you
have called strikes and the Pitcher is
trying to throw it to at the worst part
of the strike zone for you and if he
succeeds in getting into that corner
three times and you don't swing you're
out and and investing it's a no it's a
no called strike thing so I can sit
there all day and somebody can FR me one
company after another and finally I got
one in my sweet spot uh both of you have
chosen both wives and partners well um
Charlie Munger added what to you oh
Charlie Munger changed my view
he refined them in a huge way in terms
of looking for the Quality Companies and
and and looking for the ability to make
an investment that would work out well
for five or 10 or 20 years as opposed to
something might there might be one I
call it cigar butd investing where there
was one puff left in the cigar but the
cigar was free so you picked up these
disgusting looking things and got one
puff out of and went onto another one
and that worked okay but it was small
scale and it really doesn't build
something satisfying so so he he kept
forcing me in the direction of saying
you know is this really a business we
want to own for forever and and do we
want to get assoc it's like a marriage I
do you want to get associated with this
person forever and it's a great way to
look at things uh Bill uh your wife
Melinda has added
what well she's mother than four
children three children how much time do
I have
because she is your partner and she was
there in the philanthropy from day one
at Microsoft I had two partners who were
amazing I had Paul Allen in the early
days and then Steve balmer's the company
got bigger and we would not have
achieved anything what we did without
those Partnerships because you know when
things are tough when you're making big
decisions having somebody who's really
in there with you committed uh you know
for me I I couldn't have done without
that for the
foundation Melinda is an amazing partner
uh she thinks about the people issues
better than I do she you know knows when
I get over excited about the science she
can uh you know make sure we're we're
being realistic about it and it makes it
fun you know last week uh I went to
Europe to World economic form she went
to Nigeria and then this weekend we just
sat and talked about okay what did we
see what does that say about the work we
should do uh and so you I don't think
I'd enjoy it without a partner in
particularly someone amazing like her
it's more fun with a partner I mean
Charlie and I have had more fun working
together than either one of us would
have had individually and we have never
had an argument after working together
for 58 years you talk every day not
anymore because we know what the other
guy's going to say we just
grunt we we talked it all out 50 years
ago so if you see Charlie and and he
says why haven't you called me you'd say
well I knew what you'd say anyway
absolutely no there's no question about
it but we still have a lot of fun
together
all right right there well let's say
number
two hi hi my name is Molly zanger I'm a
student at Barnard College um I guess
what I'm basically wondering is what
your main considerations are when you're
choosing where to donate and what causes
to donate to and what the main
challenges are that are associated with
that yeah well I wholesaled it because I
made a choice that I wanted to have well
originally my first wife and I planned
that I would pile it up and she would
UNP it but uh and and uh that was plan
number one but she she died uh in in
2004 and then I had the problem of of
figuring out the best way to distribute
what would turn out to be a lot of money
and I
wanted I wanted some people who had
similar values and similar objectives to
what I had but I also wanted people who
would pour in intelligence and energy
and Casa Bill and Melinda a lot of their
own funds would work at it full-time but
who really saw society as i s which was
that every life is of equal value and
and that if you start with that and then
you figure what you're might be good at
changing whether it's in medicine or
education or early learning or whatever
it may be uh you know that was my answer
was the the wholesale and Retail
philanthropy would drive me crazy but
wholesale philanthropy I really
like Bill yeah for our work at the
foundation
the belief in Innovation which uh both
Melinda and I sought
Microsoft our question was okay how do
we bring that kind of innovation to help
the world's poorest and we learned that
coming up with new vaccines that
although you can pay a lot to have them
created the marginal cost comes down to
less than a dollar so great getting a
new vaccine for the main cause of
diarrhea or pneumonia uh that can be a
phenomenal thing so you're looking for
these super nonlinear dramatic things
because as a you know per poor person or
compared to Government
funding philanthropy is actually quite
small and yet funding vaccine projects
the government isn't as good as that as
a philanthropist who assembles a team
and over time is learning how to do that
very well and we had models you know
Rockefeller Foundation was a phenomenal
Foundation the Green Revolution is just
one of many things that they did which
raised agricultural productivity and
saved avoided hundreds of millions uh
starving and so studying the other
foundations that have taken these big
breakthroughs uh and created model out
of those that was very informative to
the to what we've gone after what's the
most important lesson you've learned
though
about making investments from the
foundation today that you learned along
the way
well I think uh when we started out I
thought that just coming up with a new
vaccine or drug alone would be enough
and that the world would then take that
and get it out to all the children of
the world uh you know partly through
field visits I did that Melinda did
looking at the statistics that delivery
system doesn't get out to a lot of the
kids and so get having to figure out how
people were hired or how that was funded
and measured this what's called Primary
Healthcare uh we were drawn into that
out of necessity it didn't fit the
normal sort of in the lab you know come
up with this great
concoction and uh and yet in order to
achieve our goals we needed to to think
about those delivery pieces in fact
sometimes the state of the product uh
actually had to be simpler in some ways
in order to get through that very
limited delivery capacity and now we're
getting 86% of the world's children with
vaccines it was uh about 70% when we got
started so that's good increase we still
have have 14% to go billinda have
amazing uh convening and persuasive
Powers as well so I mean they they bring
something far more to it than just money
uh I mean they they work incredibly hard
as do my three children in their
foundations but they work incredibly
hard at getting government's involved in
vaccines or whatever it may take and
that that that just is you know it's
it's an extra Dimension that I I think
very few uh people have in the field
yeah I mean it's a
Hands-On travel to when Melinda is in
African she's holding a little baby I
mean she is actually thinking you know
this kid needs to be vaccinated has a
decent chance in education and all that
I feel the same way about the kid but
what I really think is is he going to
pee on me you know can I hand him so so
I you know there's just a difference in
that human touch that makes a big
difference I'm halfway in between I
think he's closer to me actually number
one number three and number four first
one then three then
four hi I'm Mala Gus Swami at the
Columbia business school if the current
government were to ask for your advice
on immigration or healthc care reform
what would you recommend to
them Mar well on on immigration the well
immigration I mean this country
is built on it I I always say the people
that anti immigration you know let's put
it in
retroactively you everybody leaves it's
uh
this this this country if you think
about it still heard this before from me
but we are sitting here in part because
of two Jewish immigrants who in 1939 and
August signed the most important letter
perhaps in the history of the United
States and you can you can go to the
internet and and go to Surge Bing and
uh
[Applause]
and and just type in Einstein Roosevelt
1939 Leo zard and Albert Einstein two
immigrants came here they both they came
directly from Germany zard came from
Hungary before that and they told
President Roosevelt that the Germans
were likely to develop and Adam bom
which was likely to work it's less than
a full page and we better get to work on
something fast and that the Manhattan
Project came out of that and if it
hadn't been for those two immigrants you
know who knows whether we'd be sitting
in this
room
immigration I'm going let him
handle no but I mean you know but I mean
you knew Andy bro you I mean just just
go up and down the line I mean right
it's this country has been built blessed
exactly by by immigrants and you can
take them from any country you want and
they they've come here and they've found
something that unleashed the potential
that the place where they left did not
and and and we're the product of it uh
let me the question also was about
Healthcare I
mean what can you tell us about
Healthcare that you think is important
in terms of the consideration of what
might happen I mean if you were building
a health care plan for America What
would be the elements that you would
want to
include well there's no doubt that in
order to provide decent Health
Care the percentage of GDP devoted to it
is going to go up over time it's already
very high and yes there's some
efficiencies to be gained uh in that you
know 18% uh or so number but as Society
ages as we come up with new things like
joint replacement organ transplant which
are going to create lots of human
benefits we're going to have to have
more resources overall including more
government resources for
healthcare and so it's a tough problem
because you have both access problems
today and you have cost problems today
and you know I whenever I look at a
problem I have this one uh simple lens
which is Al Innovation should help here
but in this case Innovation while it
will provide breakthrough uh drugs that
will save costs like if you can cure
Alzheimer's which we certainly haven't
done yet that will save on huge
long-term care costs so we have these
chronic diseases that we've made less
progress on uh than than some of the
others and you know the market mechanism
to get Pharma to go after those things
and the basic research us funds I am
quite optimistic that we'll have some
advances but they'll also give us some
very expensive things that will mean
we're we're spending more money against
it and I do hope you know that at some
point that we really are calling on the
best Minds to look at the incentives for
the breakthroughs the most efficient uh
system we have here I think there's a
lot of unhappiness in the country now uh
stems from the the fact that the Health
Care system isn't delivering and yet uh
you know people are saying less
government more government uh you know I
don't think they're been given the the
depth of Education about why it's so
tough that over time will help them uh
uh vote for the the right the depth of
explanation uh let me let me go I'll go
to Facebook in just a moment but where
was I I promis 34 and six uh three is
there and six is up there so go 3 six
and then we'll go to
Facebook hi my name is Josh schaer I'm a
dental resident at Columbia my question
is for future doctors and dentist of
America what what advice do you have in
giving about having a proper balance of
providing that Healthcare but also
mastering the concepts of business and
economics well at to gandi is you know
incredible
author he in the current issue of the
New Yorker has a uh the latest in uh
wonderful article articles about the
Health Care system and he's talking
about the people who do sort of heroic
surgery like himself are paid twice as
much is the the people who are on an
ongoing basis in a great incremental way
learning about the patient and and
seeing what works for them and he it's a
calling cry to say hey th that part of
the system needs to be run better needs
needs more resources uh and you know so
I think it's brilliant that he's saying
that and it also corresponds to what uh
what is working in in some other
countries okay uh
six hello my name is Dar from Columbia
College so you both have invested a
great deal of money abroad but there is
a prevailing belief by some that there
are pressing issues in America there are
poor people here there are sick people
here and we should deal with that first
before even tackling anything abroad so
what are your thoughts on
that well my own personal thought is
that
every life is of equal value and
uh in many
ways in many ways if you have a limited
number of dollars you actually can do
more for more people outside the United
States we do have greater resources here
for our 320 million people than exists
around the world for 7even plus billion
people so if if you you can improve the
lot of more people by intelligence ly
spending a billion dollars or any other
number uh in other areas of the world
actually than here and I get uh you know
coming from Omaha and having the money I
have people can say well why not spend
it all in Omaha you know you grew up
here in Omaha has done all kinds of
things for you and I absolutely
acknowledge that but in the end if I've
got X dollars to spend I can make life
better for more people if I can have it
intelligently allocated in other parts
of the world actually than the United
States and that draws a fair amount of
criticism but you know I live with it
because I just what I believe all lives
have equal value is really the driving
force behind Foundation I I'm an
accident I I I won the ovarian Lottery
when I was born in the United States in
1930 it was 40 to1 against me I was male
that now it's 80 to1 against being a
male in the United States in 1930 I was
just plain lucky my life would have been
far different Bill always said if I had
been born a long time ago I'd have been
some animals lunch because I can't run
fast and I can't climb trees and
everything you know and I'd be saying i
alligate c i allate you
know it wouldn't work and you know I was
lucky but 79 out of the 80 weren't as
lucky as I was at that time Bill go
ahead bill in terms of the helping
people in other countries the foreign
aid budget of the US is is
8% of the budget and there will be in in
the years ahead a discussion about is
that worth doing it saves lives for
typically about $1,000 of life saved and
in terms of stability and countries uh
eventually being self-sufficient to be
part of the world economy there are some
some huge benefits to that so if we were
talking about should we spend 20 or 30%
overseas okay you know that would be a
very interesting discussion but what
we're trying to preserve uh is something
that's gotten smarter and smarter all
the time has proven benefits all all
which are things that our foundation
co-invests invests in the the same
things like like the polio thing is is
8% so I'm hopeful that in a big world
that uh can remain a priority all right
let me go to another Facebook question
this is from uh uh Nadia aqual says how
might Bill and waren encourage
Innovation particularly among teens and
young adults how do you encourage
Innovation well I think you have a
market system that provides reward for
it yeah that's one and and we have it I
mean we we we have an incubator for
innovation in the United States and you
know Bill can drop out of school Andy
Grove can come from Hungary and I mean
this it we just welcomes it and thank
God I mean that's why we have the kind
of prosperity that we have I mean the
question of how it gets divided is a
secondary question and that is not get
solved as well by the market system but
but our system is just designed for it
and look at what has happened all right
number
one also I want to make sure we get the
people in the back so we only have five
minutes left so there's a couple of
hands up in the back so please recognize
it hi uh my name is sahir uh I'm a
senior in the engineering school uh as
men of such great influence uh I'm
curious and we touched a little bit
about this in the last question but how
you deal with reconciling your
convictions with maybe what is believed
by the public maybe even a majority
considering that you have the wealth and
power and fame to make such great things
happen either well I don't see you know
the the convictions I
have uh you know I love sharing them and
talking uh to people and understanding
you know where people disagree uh I you
know I can be overly science Centric
about things I uh you know there's all
sorts of causes that are super important
that our foundation because we have
limited resources we don't get to go and
do there's there's lots of diseases uh
there's aspects of Education you know
part of the strength of philanthropy is
its diversity and and and so just by
sharing the fact that uh it's fun it it
really can have measurable impact I hope
that sets an example for all of
philanthropy I don't happen to believe
that you know my voice should be that
much louder than other people uh you
know so you know some of these big
political donations you know at least uh
you know I and I think Warren as well
you know we've chosen not to have that
be uh a huge way that you know we're
spending our money that's a personal
choice uh you know the money's being
saved for not for the megaphone but for
the the the work of the foundation yeah
we get a Podium of a certain sort you
know and but people do
not with a partner like Charlie muger
you don't have to worry about my views
being accepted
automatically point out the shortcomings
and the the influence of money in
politics I really think is is bad news
for this country I think citizens united
was a terrible decision and uh uh the
idea that somebody can pour millions and
millions of dollars into a campaign and
in certain cases it not even be
identified I I think really kind of goes
counter to kind of America I believe in
the two of you created along with blend
and others created the giving pledge
how's that
going going to Ric go it really is going
to Ric yeah philanthropy is kind of a
lonely tell what it is exactly yeah okay
this is um you know we love philanthropy
of all types uh and part of the strength
of American philanthropy is actually
people with very little who uh are
incredibly generous here though we said
for the people who are are super lucky
uh have over a billion dollars we want a
group who are working together who are
committed to give the majority of their
wealth away to learn from each other
what's worked what hasn't worked how do
you involve your kids uh how do you hire
staff and they'll find areas they're
working on together and cooperate but
we're not pulling any money and we
thought we'd get you know 20 25 people
together and in fact now uh we're at
156 so
uh it is a wonderful yearly event I've
made some great people I do think that
the quantity and quality has gone up
because we're getting together we'll
never be able to measure that in a
direct way and uh we're making special
efforts in China and India because now
we have a lot of wealth there that
wasn't there before and uh in their own
way I think they by having a strong
philanthropic sector that will help
those countries and and therefore help
the world what's interesting now bill
and I are having dinner actually with
the group tonight for example but if you
go back 100 or 150 years people got
Wealthy by making some money from the
first oil refinery or Ste and Mill and
building another one and Henry Ford
would build a plant to build cars and
then they it would be from actually from
retained earnings which eventually
turned into cash now you can get rich
very young just by having an idea and
you can get that idea monetized and
capitalized in a way that you cannot
believe so we are particularly
interested in getting younger people
interested Ed in philanthropy because
they there will be huge there are huge
fortunes by people that are now in their
20s and 30s and just think about those
the potential for that group and so this
thing has worked out way way better
including getting younger people uh to
join us number
six hello my name is Christina Nunes I'm
a fellow Dental student to Josh thank
you for speaking with us today um I'm
curious about your Insight related to
relationships
I'm personally given a desire to honor
myself and respect other individuals
have found it difficult throughout life
to discern um which relationships to
really Foster and invest in and accept
challenges from and which to kind of
forego and abandon because they're more
harmful than
helpful um so are there any major life
lessons that you two have learned
through your personal experiences well
it's a very important question and the
more you will move in the direction of
the people that you associate with so I
it's important to associate with people
that are better than yourself and
actually the most important decision
many of you make not all of you will be
the spouse you're choosing and uh you
really you want to associate with people
who are the kind of person you'd like to
be you you'll move in that direction and
the most important person by far in that
respect is your spouse I can't over upt
besides how important that is and you're
right the the friends you have uh they
will form you as you go through life and
uh uh make some good friends keep them
for the rest of your life but have them
be people that you admire as well as
like Bill you add to that yeah some
friends do bring out the best in you uh
and and so those it's good to invest in
those friendships
uh and you know some friends challenge
you uh about things you're doing uh and
that you know that level of intimacy is
great I wouldn't say that I'm you know I
was so obsessed with work I didn't
invest I'd say in my 20s and 30s as much
as I should have it's really through
Melinda and seen you know other people I
realized okay that is uh you know it's
really worth the investment to have
those people as uh you're always there
to help them and and vice versa so so we
started with friendship and and we end
with a question of friendship I want to
thank first of all all of you in this
audience for coming here at Colombia un
University for the face Facebook
audience coming here to uh Colombia
where we faculty and students from all
of the disciplines at Colombia uh and
they have participated most of all uh we
want to thank uh this afternoon as we
said and have a conversation with Warren
Buffett and Bill Gates thank you thank
you
am